From: Cojocaru,Vlad (
Date: Sun Aug 12 2007 - 02:54:44 CDT

Dear Alex,

As it seems that my email was so annoying ... I just want to say some things ...

Far from me to disrespect anybody who spends time and reads these emails, especially that I am one of those people. Maybe I have not answered lots of emails in the past months because of good reasons that I am not going to write here, but I have answered some in the past and I still get people asking me things and I am very happy to help whenever I can ...

Otherwise, I fully understood your reasoning about cross posting, and I will not do it in the future!!! However, since I do not mind to edit my addresses which probably takes 1-2 seconds, I thought other people will not mind it as well ... I was wrong, I appologize but I do not think that my email was so annoying to get such long and harsh replies ...

The email I sent has very much to do both with VMD and NAMD: 1) the membrane has been created with VMD and therefore the results might have something to do with the initial model that VMD supplies ... and 2) simulations have been performed with NAMD.

These are the 2 very simple reasons why I sent the emails to both lists and not to others that you list like AMBER, CCL ....
And I have thought quite a lot of the results and read quite a lot of literature before posting anything so I can assure you that I am not looking for any sucker to figure it out for me .... I hope that by just reading the email and not trying to read between lines, people have understood my reasoning for posting to both lists.

Honestly, when I get an email from the list, first I try to figure out whether I am able to asnwer the question being asked and then I start to try to read between the lines and to analyze the addresses to which the email has been sent.

With this, I would like to thank the lists for all the help provided during time (and I do that in my talks as well as I think its very important... ). I assure everybody that I respect all those who spend time to read these emails and answer even to stupid questions.

Best wishes

-----Original Message-----
From: Axel Kohlmeyer []
Sent: Sat 8/11/2007 6:33 PM
To: Cojocaru,Vlad
Cc: VMD Mailing List
Subject: RE: vmd-l: bilayer thickness in simulation of POPC membranes
On Sat, 11 Aug 2007, Cojocaru,Vlad wrote:

dear vlad,

and everybody else who is wondering why people
get offended by cross-posting to the namd and
vmd mailing lists. i thought it might be helpful
to add a few words that help understanding
what is going on.

VC> Dear Olaf,
VC> I am sorry ... but I thought that people on the vmd list might have
VC> experience with this as well ... There may be people who have done
VC> lipid simulations with other MD software and still use VMD for the
VC> visualization of their results...

given that reasoning, you should have cross-posted to the amber,
pymol, charmm, computational chemistry, etc. mailing lists as well.
that would have, at least from the statistical point of view,
increased your chances of finding somebody.

you see, there is a very thin line between asking for help and 'spamming'.

VC> That was the only reason I posted this email to the VMD list as well ..
VC> I appologize if I was wrong ...

nobody would have minded, if you had worded it accordingly
and sent two different mails. the problem with cross-posting
is that it is annoying for people who respond to posts on
mailing lists, that they have to edit the address line to
avoid getting bounced on the mailing list they are not subscribed.
this can easily double the effort of answering and if you
get a lot of mail, you get annoyed.

cross-posting also has the problem, that people tend to
understand it as 'gee, i don't want to spend the time to
think about it, so i just send it to all of them. there
may be a sucker somewhere that can figure it out for me'.
while i am convinced you didn't mean it like that, it is
easily perceived as thus and people should be aware of it.

writing takes away a lot from communication and people
try to read the missing parts between the lines, and
one always has to be aware of how easily this can go wrong.

finally, since people answering on mailing lists are not
getting any money for it, they expect to be at least 'paid'
with respect for what they do, and spending the effort to
write a specific mail addressed to a forum is one way.

with best regards,

VC> Cheers
VC> vlad
VC> -----Original Message-----
VC> From: Olaf Lenz []
VC> Sent: Fri 8/10/2007 6:42 PM
VC> To: Cojocaru,Vlad
VC> Subject: Re: vmd-l: bilayer thickness in simulation of POPC membranes
VC> Hash: RIPEMD160
VC> Hello!
VC> I do not see what this question has to do with VMD. I would ask you to
VC> please not cross-post this kind of questions to both lists, but to
VC> choose one instead.
VC> Olaf
VC> Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux)
VC> Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE -
VC> iD8DBQFGvJWJtQ3riQ3oo/oRA0U3AJwKckUoi+rKT0DqTumYjnhhbo8a1gCfaZSK
VC> xHZf7xwtXinxer2/E8Y21iw=
VC> =3XsY

Axel Kohlmeyer
   Center for Molecular Modeling   --   University of Pennsylvania
Department of Chemistry, 231 S.34th Street, Philadelphia, PA 19104-6323
tel: 1-215-898-1582,  fax: 1-215-573-6233,  office-tel: 1-215-898-5425
If you make something idiot-proof, the universe creates a better idiot.